Ex mormon dating

Tinder but for Ex-Mormons. Ex-Mormon dating app launches to help 'bypass the explanation of your faith journey' Photo: (Courtesy of NEW: Ex-Mormon Dating App) Zac Taylor wanted to create an app ... Ex-Mormon Connection for Women. 3 Members. Started Apr 9 in New Braunfels, USA. Ex-Mormon Women of NOVA and DC. 47 Members. Started Feb 29 in Vienna, USA. Houston Ex-Mormon Meetup Group. 3 Members. Started Feb 24 in Houston, USA. Pittsburgh Post/Ex/Transitioning/Still Mormon Meetup Group. 11 Members. I haven't seen a dating sight for former mormons. I have seen a lot of profiles on dating website where the girl states that she used to be or was brought up mormon. That is typical in Utah. For me I want a woman who will help me forget about my LDS past and bring me away from LDS culture cuz most of my family and friends are still in the tscc. 3 Essential Dating Tips for Ex-Mormons. If mormonism left that Ex-Jews celebrate their Ex- status by having a mock Passover Seder where they served bacon cheeseburgers, no one would think this is acceptable. It would be wildly prejudiced and bigoted, but for Ex-Mormons, this is totally ok. NEW :: An Ex-Mormon Dating App For Those On The Same Religious Journey Dating can be difficult. With all the nuances of religion tossed in the mix it can be downright frustrating. We developed 'NEW :: An Ex-Mormon Dating' because we want people to enjoy meeting people stress and worry free knowing that anyone they meet on the app has an ... free shipping for orders above $99. 877 - 880 - 0004 3 Essential Dating Tips for Ex-Mormons. I want to prove to those questioning their faith that there is hope and happiness after Mormonism. Last winter, I went through a dating of deep mormonism. A lost job, lost friends, and a world full of suffering and complex ambiguity frequently leaves me feeling alone, helpless, and hopeless. NEW :: An Ex-Mormon Dating App is a dating app for people who have changed their religious beliefs. Dating is hard. Especially when you mix in religion. NEW :: A Post And Ex-Mormon Dating App makes it simple to date people based on who you are NOW. Address. Phone: 972-499-4995. Apr. 2016 The Mormon Church general authority L. Whitney Clayton tells BYU graduates to disconnect from ex-Mormons and avoid relationships with 'exes'. The logical conclusion given to these recent graduates is to disconnect from mothers, fathers, sisters, brothers, and other relatives and friends who no longer believe in Mormonism. A new dating app seeks to fill the gap for former members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints looking for relationships.

The Best Exmormon Forum on the Internet!

2009.06.16 20:53 Measure76 The Best Exmormon Forum on the Internet!

A forum for ex-mormons and others who have been affected by mormonism to share news, commentary, and comedy about the Mormon church.
[link]


2020.09.29 06:11 BestGarbagePerson I didn't get my License until I was 24. Not because I didn't want to...my parents actively sabotaged me. [warning long]

To preface this probably wouldn't have been a problem if I was living in a European city with good public transport, but I lived in the US in the suburbs with terrible public transit.
Also to preface: I was a classic "never can be good enough' scapegoat, in that I was not a delinquint at all (actually the opposite), but was constantly under fire (accused of things I didn't do, but if I objected I was called a liar, aka the classic no-win scenario) and never good enough for my parents (both have personality disorders co-morbid with other issues). I was verbally abused constanty, occationally physically abused (not every day), and always treated like whatever I did was wrong and needed to be shut down, even just being "too happy." I am the oldest in my family btw.
So, to the point:
My n-rents refused to teach me how to drive, multiple times, even though I knew I would need to learn in order to get away from them in the suburbs. And boy did I want to.
Basically as a result I had no proper teenage years at all, as all my peers became increasingly independent (I also was not allowed to go out to visit friends), nor proper college years (without a car in a tiny town? lol), and was very very disadvanged in my life for a long time.
Here are some key moments in the battle I had with my parents to teach me how to drive:
...1. On my 16th Birthday, my dad bought himself a brand new car, then showed it off to me, and let me know because it is a stick shift he will not ever teach me how to drive it. It took me years to figure out how fucked up this was, although it hurt ofc when I was a teen I was so abused I couldn't even register it.
...2. Because my parents would not let me learn how to drive in their other (automatic) car, I took a summer job when I was 16, so I could afford private lessons with a driving teacher who would let me drive his car. My parents initially agreed they would sign off on my learners permit if I did this with my own money. At the end of my very last lesson (many dollars spent on this, for a teenager it was all my hard earned minimum wage dollars, I never had an allowance), they refused to sign the permit and refused to take me to the driving test. I was crushed. This was one of the first of many "rug pulling" betrayals I had from my horrifically fucked up parents.
...3. My dad selected the college that I was supposed to go to (otherwise he would not financially support me.) The college was BYU, if you don't know it, this is the Mormon college with extremely strict rules even for non-Mormons who attend at they time they also would expell anyone who was gay, just for being gay (I'm bisexual). I am not Mormon and never was and neither were my parents. If you also don't know, the college is in the middle of a no-where town with even shittier public transit (Utah after all.) I begged my dad for my safety and mental health to teach me how to drive before I went. He refused. .....To continue with this incident 3, I never understood why he wanted me to go to this college. I didn't find out until I was 30 years old from a distant cousin, that he wanted me to go there because he was cheating on my mom with another woman living in Provo, Utah. So it would be a cover for him. ..........Long story short, I was told to move out of the dorms at BYU because policy there is no one above a freshman can live in dorms. I was also told (by my father , as I ran out of money for food and for my phone, I was paying everything except tuition out of my pocket, which my dad paid $2000 dollars for and the rest I earned via scholarship) that I had to get a job and pay my way on my own. Without a car, in Utah, in the dead of winter, while I also was a full time student, and full time cross country athlete, and not Mormon, this was basically impossible. I was basically forced to drop out because I was literally starving and couldn't pay my rent, and couldn't even get to a job interview at all. Ofc, my dad gave me endless shit for this.
....4. So after quitting this college (which I later learned not long after I started attending his mistress dumped him, which was probably why he started withdrawing support and yelling at me all the time, it was his way of being a narcissist and shifting blame.) I had to move back in with my dad. He promised me (I basically had to haggle and argue with him for everything) that if I signed up again to any college, and saved up my own money for a car myself, that he would put the first 6th months insurance on the car (so I could walk it off the lot) and teach me how to drive.
I got a job immediately upon moving in with my father, and was working at a used car dealership at the time, while I applied and got into, the very very good local community college (I intended to transfer after getting an Associates.) After 6 months of busting my ass, I got the car I wanted to get. My dad literally drived it off the lot with me, using his insurance to cover me. Interestingly he never praised me for my hard work, and in fact, was unhappy and critical of me the whole purchasing experience.
However, he took me off his insurance in 24 hours, and refused to cover for the first 6th months, and refused to teach me how to drive, because in his words "you aren't going back to BYU like we promised."
HE CHANGED THE RULES FAM.
ETA: Thinking back on this, I honestly think he decided to fuck me up after seeing how happy the car made me as we came home with it. He decided to crush my dreams because he got off on it. He will never, ever, ever admit that this is what he did, he will lie to his grave that the original agreement was that I return to BYU, not just return to any college. Anyway, who would punish their daughter like this? For NOTHING?
My car at the time had to be parked on the street, so it was without insurance and in violation of the law. I was so scared! I did not have the money (nor did I even have a credit card) to buy 6 months insurance and what's the point? He refused to teach me how to drive anyway.
So while I freaked out on what to do, I had a boyfriend (later ex, he was actually pretty awful for me) that lived exactly 2 miles away who had a spot in their driveway I could park the car. So, in the dead of night, on back streets, I very slowly drove the car and parked it there (my boyfriend refused to drive it for me, he was very much like my dad in this way, and never lifted more than finger to help me with anything). OFC my dad found out somehow, and proceeded to threaten to turn me in to the cops etc etc etc, screaming 24 hour fight and basically told me to move out in 2 months (which I was planning anyway but he ruined my earning plans.)
I waited 3 days, crying every day, and was forced to sell back the dream car I had bought to the same dealership I worked for. (I had to get my dad to drive it back to the lot for me too..) I cannot explain to you all the humiliation that was for me. I still am upset about it, over 10 years later. I had to use that money on a deposit for a new place. I couldn't afford a car of my own until I was 28, but that's jumping ahead.
...5. In the meantime, my father and mother taught all my other siblings how to drive at age appropriate times and even taught one of them stick shift. Because I was the SC they were the GC. And although I have no proof, I think my mother or father either helped my siblings purchase their own cars or their insurances or both. They also co-signed my siblings student loans as well (never did so for me.) which got them much more money than I did.
As a result, one of my sisters had a car...However, while she was finishing college, she didn't need it where she was living and after she finished she was moving out of the country so she didn't really need it. So she "gave" it to me (she took it back, she was a chronic indian giver) when she was 21-22 (last year of college) and I was 24, and convinced my mom somehow to teach me how to drive with her car.
Now we are to the last incident.
....6. My mother promises to teach me how to drive, if I do an exchange with her of a combination of house cleaning and yard work. Ofc I have to pay my own insurance etc etc, which I was prepared to do.
I should explain this to you all too, when you ask "didn't you have any friends who could help you?" No. Due to the extreme abuse I suffered growing up (I was treated like a prisoner and a pariah in my own home) I had no friends from high school, and very shitty (underdeveloped) social skills. And what time did I have for friends? I was working 2 jobs and going to school right from when I was 18, as a woman. I had no time for fun, like the other girls in college. BYU ofc, was full of freakish LDS, and me as a bisexual non-mormon tomboy - that was right out. And then I joined a very abusive cult that my father introduced me to (long story) while finishing school which was very similarly "pull yourself up by your bootstraps". (Think like SeaOrg in Scientology, except less like a prison.)
So, my mom promises to teach me, but keeps pushing the dates, "forgetting" and arguing with me that she doesn't have time to do it. My living situation is getting really bad, and I am this close to being homeless.
So how did I finally get my license? I had this feeling I was about to be homeless in my sisters car, so I drove illegally in the dead of night like a snail, around and around the neighborhood with the DMV (where they will do the test) memorizing every single intersection, parking lot, sign and speed limit. I even memorized the map. Ofc, I was terrified I'd be caught. My SC instincts were so over-wrought that I even beat myself up for doing this for years after.
In the end, I never even told my mom that I was doing the test. I drove myself there, parked there, pretended to the DMV tester that my mom just took off to the nearby starbucks, and finished the exam. At 24.
However, did I mention my sister was an indian giver? Even though I said I'd pay her for the car (and she declined) and she was sure if she decided to come back to the US she wouldn't want it or need it, she ended up wanting the car back when she returned from abroad.
When she wanted the car back, I was already NC with my parents and my other siblings. So, when she took it back, from the ages of 25 to 28, again I did not have a car (but I had a license.)
Because I was in the cult, I was making pennies and all the money was being taken by the cult. I was only able to afford (when I got out of the cult) an extremely shit car.
And then a shit car (that was shit but it wasn't extremely shit) that I have driven for the past 5 years.
I'm 35 and I have finally purchased a car that is not over 10 years old, not salvage or leaking from every hole. My credit it still fucked up from the things that my parents did to me (financial situations they put me in, promises made but then not kept, refusing to treat medical issues as a child, etc.) but yeah, I got a car now that doesn't make me feel humiliated every time I get in it.
Edit: Grammar, spelling, formatting. Sorry....
submitted by BestGarbagePerson to raisedbynarcissists [link] [comments]


2020.09.28 04:46 DanaCordelia A Plea to TLC

My friends and I have watched all the seasons, and each spinoff, of 90 Day Fiancé.
Would it be too much to ask for one “normal” couple each season? Something of a palate cleanser between idiots catfishing each other or fighting or cheating? Like, don’t get me wrong...I’ll still watch and even enjoy all the 90DF tropes, including
Senior Citizen American white male marrying 20yo woman from extremely impoverished country, demanding she sign a prenup and continually comparing her to his ex
American woman intending to marry Muslim man and reside in his home country, shocked (shocked!) when he demands she dress and behave much more conservatively and cut out the PDA
Couple having important, emotional conversations via a faulty translator app (when there is 100% a bilingual producer two feet away)
“I’m completely miserable and this will logistically never work BUT I LOVE HIM/ HER”
American claiming to be Mormon (as they drink a glass of wine, use curse words, and have premarital sex)
Bad actors of all nationalities fake-crying and looking at their reflection in the camera before repeating a canned line about drama, divorce, etc.
These are all examples of the nonsense we’ve grown to love in this franchise. And it’s by no means a complete list! But I have to admit, later seasons are becoming less and less fun when it’s one real train wreck after another. In particular, we’re working our way through season 2 of TOW right now and between Yazan’s mother screaming in Tiffany’s face (EDIT: sorry, Brittany’s face); Jihoon sobbing in the street after Deavan’s kid ran into the road in the darkness, and Ari coming to terms with living, pregnant, in a house with no toilet seat in the bathroom while her fiancé performs in a club with his hot (and flexible!) ex..........
....I find myself craving a nice boring couple planning a wedding. Show me a bride and groom who speak each others’ languages and have dated for ages, trying on wedding clothes and picking a damn cake.
It doesn’t need to be the entire show. Just a little smidgen. To lessen all the stress and despair?
Please...?
submitted by DanaCordelia to 90DayFiance [link] [comments]


2020.09.27 21:50 Ex-CultMember The "CES Letter" on STEROIDS

...is Mormonism-Shadow or Reality by Jerald & Sandra Tanner. In case any of you are not familiar with the Tanners, they were THE "anti-Mormons" for the second half of the 20th century. Nearly everything we have today regarding the problems with Mormon history and truth claims were already found by these two and compiled into numerous books, including what is often considered their "magnum opus," titled, Mormonism-Shadow or Reality. The book is a huge 600 page (small print) tome, exhaustively covering just about every critical piece of historical information found, challenging the traditional narrative, foundation and truth claims in Mormonism.
For those wanting a deep dive into the stuff not covered in Runnell's CES Letter, I would start here. This book should be in every ex-Mormon's library. Below is the table of contents:
  1. A Marvelous Work? ..............................................1
Miraculous Claims—The Only True Church?—The Best
People?—Updated Material
  1. Change, Censorship and Suppression.................5
Changing Doctrines—Rebaptism—Censorship—Changing
An Article of Faith—Key to Theology—Journal of
Discourses—Lucy Smith’s Book—Book Burning—
Suppressing the Records—Dr. Nibley Refused—Apostles’
Threats—Mormons Protest Suppression—Updated Material
  1. Changes in the Revelations ................................14
Book of Commandments—Not For Reproduction—Other
Changes—Study of Changes—Important Changes—
Unthinkable?—Updated Material
  1. Joseph Smith and Money-Digging.....................32
Joseph Smith’s 1826 Trial—Importance of Discovery—A
Common Practice—Peep Stones—Book of Mormon From
Stone—Embarrassed Over Stone—Relationship to Book
of Mormon—Working with the Rod—Affidavits and
Statements—The Treasure Hunt Revelation—Updated
Material
  1. The Book of Mormon...........................................50
The Witnesses—Character of Witnesses—Apostasy—
Strang and McLellin—Unreliable Witnesses—Martin
Harris—Oliver Cowdery—David Whitmer—Angels and
Gold Plates—Too Much Excitement—Harris’ Shaker
Book— Ancient Or Modern?—Fits Smith’s Environment—
Revivals—Infant Baptism—Church of Christ—Ministers and
Money—Westminster Confession—Masonic Influence—
Bible Influence—The Apocrypha—Old Testament—New
Testament—List Of Parallels—A Real Dilemma—Alpha and
Omega—Origin of Indians— “Wonders of Nature”—“No
Traveller Returns”—Vapor of Darkness—Not Unique—“An
Ignominious Death”—Joseph Smith’s Father’s Dream—
Smith Probably Qualified—Changes in the Book of
Mormon—Lost Book of Lehi—Making Up Names—Bible
Prophecy—Beyond the Book of Mormon—Updated Material
  1. Archaeology and the Book of Mormon .............97
A Pagan People—A Lost Civilization—Mormon Scholars
Face the Truth—Nephite Coins and Chariots—Anthon
Transcript—“Deformed English”—Bat Creek Stone—
Fraudulent Inscriptions—Kinderhook Plates—Falsification
of History— “Childish Forgeries”—Newark Stones—Tree
of Life Stone—Lehi, Sariah and Nephi?—Geography—Hill
Cumorah—Compared With Bible Archaeology—Updated
Material
  1. Changes in Joseph Smith’s History................126
Written By Joseph Smith?—New Discoveries—Film
Supplies New Evidence—Over 60% After Smith’s Death—
Rocky Mountain Prophecy—Selected Changes—
Conclusion—Updated Material
  1. The First Vision.................................................143
Vision Criticized—“Strange” Accounts—An Important
Change—Revision Required—First History—Too Many
Stories—Doctrinal Change—Source of Confusion—An
Evolving Story—No Revival in 1820—Lane and Stockton—
Moving the Revival—A Changing Story—Joseph a
Methodist—Joseph Changed His Mind—Clandestine’s
Errors—Professor Hill’s Speech
  1. The Godhead .....................................................163
From One to Many—The Heavenly Mother—
Serious Changes—Removing the Lecturers—“Inspired”
Corrections—Elohim—Hands Or Wings?—A Changeable
God—The Holy Ghost—No Real Answers—Updated
Material
  1. The Adam-God Doctrine .................................173
Falling Upward— “Our Father And Our God”—Confusion
and Strife—Updated Material
  1. The Priesthood..................................................179
Added Later—Aaronic Priesthood—Melchizedek
Priesthood—High Priests—First Presidency—Age of
Ordination
  1. The Arm of Flesh..............................................183
Thinking a Sin?—No Revelation—Updated Material
  1. False Prophecy..................................................186
The Canadian Revelation—The Lord’s Coming—A Temple
in Zion—The Civil War—The Gathering—Joseph’s Boys—
Other Prophecies—Updated Material
  1. The Hereafter ...................................................196
Universalists—Joseph Changes His Mind—Mormon
Purgatory—Degrees Of Glory—Dissolved and Reorganized
Spirits
  1. The Missionary System....................................200
  2. Plural Marriage................................................202
Reason For Revelation—Breaking the Law—Contradicts
Book of Mormon—Contradicts the Bible—Threatened
with Destruction—Wives Before the Revelation—Leaders
Puzzled—Sorrows of Polygamy—Discord in Joseph’s
Home—Lived With His Wives—Number of Wives—Taking
Other Men’s Wives—Polygamy or Promiscuity?—John C.
Bennett—Sarah Pratt Affair—Martha Brotherton—Nancy
Rigdon—Strange Marriages—Polygamy and Courtship—
Only 2%—One-Wife System Condemned—Adam a
Polygamist—God and Christ Polygamists—Essential to
Salvation—Updated Material
  1. The Manifesto...................................................231
After the Manifesto—“Manifesto A Deception”—Polygamy
in Utah Today—Taylor’s 1886 Revelation—The Dilemma—
Updated Material
  1. Mormonism and Truth ....................................245
The Mormon Battalion—Making God a Liar—Conclusion
  1. Joseph Smith.....................................................252
A Fighting Prophet—General Smith—“The Greatest
Egotist”—Mixing Politics And Revelation—Destruction of
the Expositor—Like a Lamb?
  1. The Virgin Birth...............................................260
Conclusion
  1. The Negro in Mormon Theology ....................262
Black Skin—Pre-Existence—Sons of Cain—Through the
Flood—One Drop Disqualifies—Negroes in the Priesthood
—Negroes Unhappy—Objections To Doctrine—For Cain’s
Sins—Negroes and the Gospel—Nigerian Mission—Rooted
in Prejudice—Slavery in Utah—Civil Rights—The Genesis
Group—Athletes Protest—A Serious Situation—Church
Rejects Violence—Appeasement—Dissatisfaction—A
Burning Issue—A New Revelation?—Joseph Fielding
Smith—An Honest Solution—Conclusion—Updated
Material
  1. Fall of the Book of Abraham...........................294
The Papyri Rediscovered— “Caught Flat-Footed”—History
of Papyri—Deciphering Egyptian—Spalding’s Attack—
“Dr. Webb”—Tragic Neglect—Not Out Of Date—A
Suspicious Discovery—Other Papyri Suppressed—No Gift
to Translate—Nibley Not An Egyptologist—Dr. Nelson?—
Source of Book of Abraham—Book of Breathings—Written
in Hieratic—Finding the Key—Three Witnesses Against
Book—Dr. Nibley Confused—Nibley Reverses His
Position—Abraham’s Signature—A False Translation—
Basis For Anti-Black Doctrine—From a Hole in the
Papyrus—An Unfinished Work—Complete Confusion—Just
a Memory Device?— “Bushels of Nonsense”—Facing the
Truth—The Facsimiles—Facsimile No. 2—Falsification
Proven—Part A—Part B—Part C—Part D—Part E—Part
F—Part G—Part H—Part I—Parts J and K—Joseph Smith
Responsible— “Cannot Be Revealed”—A Pagan Object—
Facsimile No. 1—Unfamiliar Writing?—Not Unique—The
Interpretation—Changes nn Facsimile—Facsimile No. 3—
Dressed Like Women—A Common Scene—Not Abraham’s
Drawings—Book Of Joseph—Joseph’s Egyptian Alphabet—
“Mere Imagination”—Nibley Repudiates Grammar—
Master Of All Languages—Possible Sources—Imitation
Genesis—Other Sources—The Moment of Truth—The
Browns’ Attack—Nibley’s New Book—More on the God
Min—Return to Old Facsimiles
  1. Old Testament Practices..................................370
Wine And Curses—Animal Sacrifice
  1. Mormon Scriptures and the Bible ..................373
Paine’s Influence—Evidence Compared—Dead Sea
Scrolls—Isaiah Text—Evidence For New Testament—
Papyri Finds—“130,000 Different Readings”—“Inspired
Revisions”—Weak Points—Beyond the Text—“Drastically
Changed”—Revising the Revisions—Conclusion—Updated
Material
  1. Blood Atonement..............................................398
Capital Crimes—Was It Actually Practiced?—Updated
Material
  1. The Word of Wisdom.......................................405
Origin Of Revelation—Joseph’s Example—Joseph’s Bar—
Young’s Distillery—Wine and Visions—Hypocrisy
  1. The Mormon Kingdom....................................414
Council of Fifty—Joseph Made King—Joseph For
President—Brigham Young As King—Church and State
One—No Democratic Elections—Moses Thatcher—Attack
on America—Decline of the Kingdom—Conclusion—
Updated Material
  1. The Danites.......................................................428
Attempted Explanations—Origin of the Danites—Joseph
Smith to Blame—Stealing from the Gentiles—Cutting
Throats—“War of Extermination”—Mormon Crimes—
Joseph Surrenders—Trouble in Illinois—Using the Mean
Devils—Bill Hickman—Orrin Porter Rockwell
  1. Temple Work ....................................................451
Baptism for the Dead—Endless Genealogies—Elijah the
Prophet—All in Vain?—Temple Marriage—Connected With
Polygamy—Sealing in Spite of Sin—A Secret Ceremony—
Updated Material
  1. The Temple Ceremony ....................................462
By a Temple Worker
  1. Changes in the Temple Ceremony ..................474
Bloody Oaths—Oath of Vengeance—Other Changes—
Testimony on Ceremony—Sealing Men to Men—Conclusion
  1. The Temple Ceremony and Masonry.............484
Joseph Becomes a Mason—Masonry in Temple Ritual—Only
One Explanation—Embarrassing Questions—Conclusion
  1. The Mountain Meadows Massacre.................493
The Utah War—The Massacre—After the Massacre—Lee’s
Excommunication—Trial and Execution—Responsibility
For Massacre—Church Opposes Study
  1. Mormonism and Money ..................................516
Church Funds For Private Gain—Young Becomes Rich—
Joseph F. Smith’s Testimony—Over $1,000,000 a Day—Tax
Problems—Control of News Media—No Paid Ministry?—
Church or Business—Updated Material
  1. Speculation, Illegal Banking ...........................528
and Counterfeiting
Speculation—The Kirtland Bank—Disaster—Bankruptcy—
Fraudulent Acts—Counterfeiting—Apostles Indicted—
“Bogus Brigham”—The Whittlers—Government
Records—A Rapid Exodus—Bogus Makers Go West
  1. Blood Flows in Utah.........................................545
Killing the Thieves—Parrish Murders—Young Indicted for
Murder—No Protection in Utah
  1. Miscellaneous History and Doctrine ..............560
Birth Control—Compressed Spirits—Vegetable Spirits—A
Year’s Supply of Food—John Whitmer’s History—The
Living Earth—Changing the Blood
  1. Facing Reality...................................................563
If you want a FREE slightly condensed version of this book, the Tanners have kindly provided a PDF version of their other published book The Changing World of Mormonsim right here:
http://www.utlm.org/onlinebooks/changecontents.htm
I really wish Admin would add a link to this book on their front page.
Also, see the Tanners' website which provides a wealth of information. The following link is to their topical index:
http://www.utlm.org/navtopicalindex.htm
Every time I see posters come here asking questions about the history, or seeking new books to read about the history, they should all just start with the above because it's probably in the above two books. Mormonism-Shadow or Reality should be the basic textbook for anyone questioning the church or wanting to learn more about the controversial parts of Mormonism.
submitted by Ex-CultMember to exmormon [link] [comments]


2020.09.26 21:36 Zaubermaus_3 Vent from nevermo: F*cked up inlaws, trigger warning- pedo/incest/sexual assault

I love this sub, lots of support.
I’m nevermo, husband is exmo, FIL is Mormon, SIL is Mormon, MIL is new exmo, BIL #1 exmo, BIL #2 mormon.
I just need to yell this into the void.
My inlaws are so fucked up (with exception of MIL) and I need to vent. I absolutely adore my MIL, the rest suck.
This is over the course of 12 years.
2011, I noticed really inappropriate behavior from SIL (15) and FIL. SIL was constantly rubbing all over her dad, I’d see them cuddling a lot, like spooning, full body spooning cuddles. She would ask him to come to her bedroom and they would be there for a hour or more. The door was ajar, they were spooning in bed. She would fake tummy aches to get him to rub her lower abdomen. She would shove her mother out of the way, when ever the mother tried to act affectionate towards the father. My FIL would also pet my hair and try to touch my thigh, every time my husband left the room. I’d freeze and panic, really uncomfortable. No ones dad has ever touched me.
I voiced this behavior was super red flag to my husband and my MIL. Husband told me that was normal family affection and I was just jaded because my family was abusive. My MIL broke down and told me she felt the same way as I did. MIL talked to SIL and found out what was actually going on. My FIL sexually abused his own 15 year old daughter several times. Husband and I call CPS. He went to jail on work release for a year, and on probation after that. The church tired to cover it up and lied to the detectives, they told the detectives we were lying about the abuse. Husband and I had to testify against FIL.
FIL blamed my MIL for aging and not being as hot as a teenager. FIL blamed 15 year old SIL for seducing him. SIL only got therapy through church therapists. Church told SIL and MIL that they had to forgive FIL, and that he was the head of the household. Church made SIL apologize for her sexual transgressions. SIL did a missionary trip for the church. SIL comes back (22), the behavior between her and her dad pick up where it left off. MIL leaves and divorces FIL. SIL moves in with MIL. SIL realizes she was being groomed by her father and cuts contact with him. SIL marries Mormon military officer after only knowing him a few weeks.
SIL is devout Mormon. When my husband left the church , and came out as bisexual and pagan age 25. She harassed the living shit out of him. Mailing, texting, emailing church doctrine. Even sending him church doctrine on his deployments to harass him. There hasn’t been one conversation with her where she doesn’t harass him about going back to the church. She told me that our children belong to the church and there was a long argument over it. She also said a lds missionary trip is exactly like her brother’s military deployment. That pissed us off, my husband is a disabled vet. They are absolutely not the same. I’ve had to tell her not to harass and stalk her ex boyfriends several times. I feel so bad for the dudes. She went off on long rants about her being sexually abused by her father was part of god’s divine plan.
She also acts hyper sexual for being Mormon. She climbs all over her brothers and dad. Her favorite thing to do is sit in their laps with her arms around them and her breasts in their face. Like horny drunk college student style. The brothers freeze and look so uncomfortable. My husband has had to tell her to get out of his lap several times or he refuses to sit down so she can’t try to sit on him. She only acts this way towards her father, brothers, and who ever she’s dating. She doesn’t do this to anyone else. When she does send my husband gifts, they usually have not so hidden messages. She loves to send middle finger gifts.
SIL is extremely entitled, and acts like it. FIL and MIL felt guilty for the abuse. They paid for her college, living expenses, car, everything. My husband was forced to work for everything and they would take his money and food. They would also break into our apartment unannounced, random times of the day. Had to buy new locks and then had to move and not tell them where we lived. We lived on food stamps and hand outs from food pantries. They never helped us. Husband joined the military to pay for college. BIL#1 had same experience. BIL #2 is just as entitled as SIL. Now realizing the “good Mormon” children received parental help, and the ones that left the church did not.
I’m so angry at that cult and my FIL for fucking her up so bad. We used to be best friends. She just shoves church doctrine down our throat , she acts creepy, and her behavior is crazy. I can’t have her near my kids. We don’t really talk to her anymore. I don’t want my kids exposed to this or thinking its normal. My kids keep asking where FIL is or why they don’t see him. Not sure what to tell them.
FIL blames MIL for breaking up the family with the divorce, and tries to blame the victim. BIL #2 sides with FIL. SIL, BIL#1, husband side with MIL. It’s astonishing how one piece of shit can destroy 3 generations of family.
I hate my FIL so much.
He has cancer right now and I hope he dies from it.
I have soooo many more stories and reasons I hate the lds cult, but I will save that for another post.
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2020.09.26 17:51 readingrachelx Brandi Glanville Unfiltered Podcast Summary – Sept. 24, 2020 episode with Andy Cohen

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2020.09.24 13:59 JBL_0 Mexican drug cartels could mess up the country’s most important lithium project

Mexican drug cartels could mess up the country’s most important lithium project
By Ben Heubl Engineering &Technology Magazine Published Tuesday, September 22, 2020

Mexico’s first lithium mine could be the nation’s insurance that it will profit from the global energy transition, or be evidence that it can’t handle the mining business. The firm in charge seems to be ignoring challenges that, if left unaddressed, could make Mexico miss out on a chance of a lifetime.
Over a decade ago, the country celebrated when a firm spotted 800,000 tonnes of lithium in the ground of central Mexico, but it wasn’t prepared for the lucky strike that was yet to come. In 2014, minerals company Bacanora Minerals Ltd hit the jackpot by locating reserves 10 times this size.
Found underground in the northern desert state of Sonora, Mexico, an arid region measuring 1.4 times the size of England, was just “above eight million tonnes” of the white gold – 250 years’ worth of resource – Bacanora claims. Sonora’s reserves alone can compete with entire countries (see graphic); Chile, for instance, with its nine million tonnes, is one of the top lithium exporters. In 2022, when extraction is due to begin, Sonora Lithium’s (SLL) supply will be almost as important.

The risk of a shortfall in lithium supply is rising, experts say. Covid-19 has played some part. There are now more bottlenecks in the market than before the pandemic; more so because of the larger macro-economic trends that keep lithium prices low and detract investments from the industry. Lithium is essential for electric vehicles and batteries, for instance. As one of the few lithium mines in the Americas – as opposed to lithium brine extraction in the South and the US – SLL could support electrifying transport towards net-zero locally.
Bacanora’s CEO Peter Secker spoke to E&T; he doesn’t hide his pride in the firm’s progress: “We are doing reasonably well.” He says it usually takes at least a decade to reach extraction stage but SLL is on the way to starting it in eight years, with just two more years now needed to engineer and build the mine.
Part of this unstoppable success is down to Bacanora’s joint venture partner, Ganfeng Lithium. Chinese Ganfeng is one of the world’s largest and most successful lithium producers that brings a lot of experience to the table says Andrew Miller, product director at intelligence firm Benchmark Mineral Intelligence.
SLL considers itself fortunate that Ganfeng’s expertise covers almost all entry lithium extraction and the production supply chain. In China, lithium entities control nearly half of the global lithium production, but Ganfeng seems comfortable enough to act alone. However, elsewhere it prefers to partner up, Secker says.

Bacanora is a local partner – it used to be listed in Canada as well as the UK but is now 100 per cent British. “We fit into [Ganfeng’s] expansion plan,” Secker says. Ganfeng entered a 22.5 per cent joint venture with Bacanora and committed to engineering the open pit mine.
The Mexican government were convinced to give this private joint venture a chance, and Covid-19 only had a subdued effect – Secker estimates the pandemic only delays the project timeline by about five to six months. Before the pandemic hit, Ganfeng’s management planned to wait to engineer the mine until after the Chinese New Year.
Mexico is largely a newcomer to lithium mining. This puts it in a weaker position, some say. But Benchmark Mineral Intelligence’s Miller says two SLL partners bring so much of their own longstanding expertise – especially Ganfeng – and contacts to the table that problems in the mining itself are unlikely.

Yet E&T found that concerns over the mining are the least of Bacanora’s worries. Mexico’s powerful drug cartels and nascent violence are a reasonable cause for concern; they could jeopardise the entire endeavour. For drug cartels to pivot into lithium trading is not entirely unfeasible, though other scenarios are more likely as mines are increasingly under attack by violent groups and organised crime, E&T learned. Security experts say mine owners must prepare for theft of valuable equipment, and extortion and kidnapping of workers.
Bacanora’s remote location may make it a desirable target for cartels. Its open-pit mine will be in a secluded spot around 11km away from a small town called Bacadehuachi, which has fewer than 1,380 inhabitants. There is lots of violence and trafficking near the US border and the mine is only 170km south of the border into Arizona. Alejandro Hope, a Mexican-based security expert, adds that state authorities have little in the way of resources to provide protection. Analysists at intelligence outfit BNamericas, covering Latin America, agree and say that Sonora has an uncomfortable history in mining robberies. Hope says the chances of Bacanora being subjected to extortion are not theoretical: “I dare to say it is even likely that the Sonora mine will be targeted.”

Faced with this reality, Secker says he doubts the cartels are interested in his mining product; previous mining thefts mainly focused on gold or silver. Yet cartels don’t shy away from experimentation. In April, a carefully planned attack involving a Cessna 206 aircraft was carried out on a mine in Sonora’s west where thieves stole gold and silver alloy from the Los Mulatos mine in Sahuaripa. Reports said the operation took only minutes. Last year’s doré bar theft of items worth between $6m and $8m, at the Noche Buena mine in the west of Sonora, was one of the biggest heists to be carried out in years.
Drug cartels are not short in ambition and sophistication, as Tom Wainwright, editor at the Economist and ex-Mexico correspondent, knows. He wrote a book a few years ago about Mexican drug cartels and their increased trend towards diversification into non-drug-related business areas. If cartels can figure out how to find experts to advise on drilling into gasoline pipes that stretch across to America and trade it on the black market, it’s worth considering the possibility that they would be interested in the SLL mining project.
Alongside this, there are other sectors that local cartels have broken into. Earlier in the year, news reports said Mexican drug cartels started trading avocados in Mexico’s south.
Security expert Hope explains that there are various ways for cartels to make trouble for SLL. Organised crime and irregular armed groups can charge protection money and threaten to hold up construction efforts by, for example, blocking roads. Many mining companies would openly liaise with organised crime groups; they wouldn’t even stop to target international mining companies, Hope says.
One of the most audacious examples of cartels moving away from drug trafficking is the trading of such commodities as iron ore. Around 2013 and 2014, such techniques reached a palpable peak when the military ceased control of Lazaro Cardenas, Mexico’s largest seaport. The government order was to strike after one legendary cartel earned more money from trades going through the port than from the drug business itself. La Familia and The Knights Templar cartels were diversifying into the mining business, Bosworth says. The military campaign at the port somewhat backfired, he argues. It cost a fortune and, despite making the port safer, it failed to ensure safety in the rest of the Michoacán state and created smaller, potentially more violent groups.

A similar thing may happen in Sonora. Since the takedown of Chapo Guzman, groups that were more tightly controlled by the active north Sinaloa cartel suddenly splintered away into smaller independent groups. They would now roam freely in the state and, as such, are more violent as they look for new business. These off-shoots usually don’t attack each other. Yet Sinaloa’s lack of top-down control became more dangerous as they looked for alternative ways to make money from extortion and violence, Bosworth says.
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E&T’s analysis checked Bacanora’s feasibility study from 2018 – a 261-page document – for any hints that security was part of the assessment. It wasn’t. CEO Secker says it should already have been part of the due diligence process when his company raised equity in the UK: “It [security] never had any impact on what we do,” he says, adding that his company operated in the country for the past 10 years and never had trouble with extortion or anything like it. To date, it invested $50m-60m in Mexico.
Security experts caution against taking these new developments lightly. The whole company must be considered; upper management of a mining company in Mexico may not even know it leaks money to a drug cartel, Wainwright says. He once interviewed a person familiar with the matter and learnt that extortion at the local-regional-manager level failed to alert upper management of a Mexican company in an international case. The source said the firm paid money to the local cartel for years without realising and it only came out because the regional manager left and the affair was exposed.
Secker explains that the south of the country is more violent than the north. “If you were in southern Mexico, states like Guerrero, you would probably be more concerned, but not where we are operating.” But crime is growing. In recent regional homicide data, E&T found that the north grew increasingly lawless; with Sonora’s homicide rate jumping by 38 per cent between 2019 and 2020 to 42 per 100,000 people, it is now comparable with other violent southern states. The Mexican regional average, for instance, is around 25 per 100,000. Authorities are less able to control the violence, experts say.
The US Department of State Travel Advisory thinks Mexico is at level 2 (‘exercise increased caution due to crime and kidnapping’) on the travel advisory scale. For Sonora, which is at level 3, it recommends to ‘reconsider traveling due to crime’.
Monthly statistics on crime from the Secretariado Ejecutivo del Sistema Nacional de Seguridad Pública suggests for Sonora that rates for extortions, car robbery with violence and homicides were all rising. Last May, its kidnapping rate jumped to 21 instances, comparable to the most violent places in the whole of Mexico.
Some hope new officials may improve the state’s security situation and turn things around. Mexico’s first secretary of security and civilian protection, Alfonso Durazo, was born and raised in Sonora and may have some compassion for the cause. Durazo wants to become governor of Sonora but, after a tragic shooting last November, the odds are stacked against him. Three women and six children, who were dual US-Mexican Mormons, were executed in an ambush while travelling through a remote area of northern Mexico. The location of the shooting (see map) was less than 100km from the Sonora lithium mine.
E&T asked Secker what precautions the company takes, and how he would deter attacks and protect workers and equipment. “The mine site is fenced, and we always travel in convoys of two or three vehicles, but you would do that in any country, not just in Mexico. We take the normal security precautions for working in a remote site but nothing specific to cartels in Mexico,” Secker says.
The chance of an attack, however, may affect the mining business of a company. In 2018, Canadian mining company Pan American Silver Corp suffered a rise in crime and violence; along roads where it transported personnel and materials to its Dolores mine in the northern city of Madera, less than 100km away from the Sonora lithium mine, the company was attacked and robbed. It went on to announce plans to roll back operations in the country.
Other challenges
There is also the risk of corruption. Many companies can sing a song of Mexico’s endemic level of corruption. It includes graft among large international conglomerates, too. Emilio Lozoya, the former head of the state oil firm Pemex, said he accepted millions of dollars of bribes from Brazilian construction giant Odebrecht to help the 2012 election campaign of former President Enrique Peña Nieto. Mexico now faces one of the biggest criminal investigation probes in history. Bacanora’s executive team may be better positioned here as it has connections that reach into the Mexican government, E&T discovered. One of the firm’s non-executive directors, Dr Andres Antonius, previously held positions within the Government of Mexico as undersecretary for energy policy, and a staff member at the Agriculture Secretariat.
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There are environmental concerns, too. Lithium mining has a lower footprint over brine extraction, which is positive (E&T produced an extensive investigation on firms in Chile). Yet, if performed incorrectly, it can have devastating effects on the local environment. Precedence dictates that this risk is feasible. For instance, according to 2018 reports, at a lithium mine in Tibet harmful toxins leaked into the environment and polluted a local river, killing animals and affecting locals.
Critics indicated that the River Bavispe runs through Sonora’s mining concession territory (see map). The feasibility study does mention the river basin, yet the mining site can still access groundwater. The report says that up to 10.7Mm3 is available annually from the Bacadéhuachi Aquifer. One concern is what happens to local water resources if the region hits a major drought? E&T found that Bacanora’s mining concessions are closely located to local towns including Granados and Nácori Chico.
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Secker is confident his company won’t mess up. It received all the necessary certificates, he says. The Sonora mine will be a zero-discharge operation and won’t leak a drop of water. It’s being recycled back into the ground.
Yet the stakes remain high and failure could mean more than just financial loss. Lithium experts say the world’s supply is on the verge of failure. Bacanora’s project could diffuse some pressure, but not for the US. For the next couple of years at least, the US will not receive a single ounce of the precious lithium from the Mexican mine. The deal has already been signed: Ganfeng in China will take half of the mined volume while the other half goes to Japan, where a leading trading company called Hanwa will process it.
It raises concerns that foreign companies could exploit Mexico’s resources and leave it in a poorer state. It happened with international conglomerates in Africa, though not for lithium but other minerals. A 2017 report by Global Justice Now found that much more wealth is leaving the world’s most impoverished continent than entering it.
Another hurdle to overcome is distance. Having to ship lithium halfway around the world isn’t ideal, experts say, and lithium firms are increasingly coming under environmental pressure. Consumers and other parts of the supply chain demand lithium miners to optimise operations and reduce the carbon impact of their transport. Shipping lithium carbonate more than 12,000km from the port of Guaymas to China, or the 11,000km to Japan, could add substantially to carbon emissions. Annually, the Bacanora plans to ship 35,000 tonnes of lithium carbonate by 2026/2027, when it reaches stage two of its agreement. This may cause between 7,300 and 13,400 tonnes in CO2 emissions per annum, according to E&T calculations. Benchmark Mineral Intelligence’s Miller says “it doesn’t necessarily make economic or technical sense to be shipping refined lithium chemicals in from China into the US or EU markets when you could locate some of that production closer to the end market”.
For the US to miss out on the deal has other effects. The country is under pressure to get lithium for its nascent EV and battery sector from somewhere else; it is developing its own lithium sources, but will always be dependent on other countries and – historically – has only accounted for 5 per cent of global lithium production, mainly from brine.
Bacanora’s agreement to exclude Mexico’s neighbouring country may still make waves down the road. America leadership has time to contemplate a better trade relationship with Mexico, and has good reason to do so, with some saying that America’s lithium demand may double or even triple by 2030. Meanwhile, Bacanora prudently avoids being caught in the middle of the US-Mexican trade war that President Donald Trump waged fiercely. A Joe Biden presidency seems more open for cooperating with Mexico. In the long-term it could lead “from Mexico being a security threat, which is how the Trump administration views it, to Mexico being a partner”, Miller says.
Mexico’s future seems bright and state officials have high hopes. Francisco Quiroga, undersecretary for mining, named investors from at least five countries who have expressed interest in Mexico’s lithium industry. Quiroga admits there are still several operational, commercial and financial challenges, while others, including Mexico’s Secretary for Environment Victor Toledo, see a problem in private companies running the show. Toledo reckons the lithium mine should be controlled by the government, but the President ruled against it. With government control, the mines could have sparked a domestic EV industry. The government thinks it doesn’t have the required resources.
https://preview.redd.it/22zkfztw43p51.jpg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8ee9fe0035e5fc634197e058af90bffcea42be08
Toledo received harsh criticism from Mexico’s largest union, which said nationalisation isn’t viable and will scare off foreign investors. One central question remains: if the government nationalised Sonora reserves and mined it itself, would it invest more to keep security high and workers safe? After all, it knows its violent groups better than foreign companies. Without guidance, Mexico’s private lithium extractors may have to learn from other countries – Bolivia, for example, with the largest lithium resources of 21 million tonnes, also struggles with safety and extortion.
Bacanora’s CEO Secker is convinced there won’t be any problems: “We had never anyone shot on our site and we don’t intend to.” But better safe than sorry. After the McEwen Mining refinery was robbed by a Mexican cartel in the Sinaloa state in 2015, Rob McEwen, CEO of the Canadian mining company, regretted how lightly he took the threat of the cartel business.
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2020.09.24 06:12 Copied_User_Name I used to be open about taking my ex back, but now I am not.

So my girlfriend and I broke up two weeks ago because she was starting college, and so was I, however she was living in a dorm and felt that she needed to get the full college experience and 'Find out what she wants in life' and also that it is smart to date other guys and not settle on the first best thing (me). Our relationship was seemingly perfect, we were best friends, played video games together, had a lot of the same interests, shared values, had amazing chemistry, and pretty much everything you could wish for in a perfect relationship.
Anyways, I've been taking this breakup pretty well, at first when we video chatted about it, she started crying, and then I cried a bit. The week following that call she was pretty wishy-washy saying "I miss you" and "I really want to f-ing hold your hand right now and feel safe", which wasn't fair and I called her out on it and told her to make up her mind. A week later, we called again and she thought long and hard on what she wanted and she did want to find out what she wants and date other guys, but she kept telling me that she still loved me and that I was really amazing.
Look, I know my worth. I agreed with her and she acknowledged that I was high-value by herself and that chances are that finding someone that can offer the type of relationship, especially at this age (18) is super rare, but not impossible.
I'll state that she is Mormon, so she isn't looking to sleep with other guys. And also, I am Agnostic.
So fast-forward to yesterday, I was hanging with my guy friends and one of them tells me about how she actually is and how she treats other people. How much of a brat she was and always had to have things her way. He even provided me with an example of when they were attending a party after theater practice, she wanted her friend to go home with her to do her spanish homework, not help, and her friend (for the sake of keeping her identity a secret, I'll call her Haley), Haley, wanted to go home with her boyfriend, Rick instead. My (not-girlfriend at the time) threw a tantrum and pushed Rick and fell backwards, proceeded to cry and run upstairs. Which sounds very immature. I also followed up with Haley to verify this information because to me, my girlfriend (now ex) seemed very sweet, caring, loving, just generally a good person, during the eight months that we've dated and hearing all of this was confusing and honestly I couldn't believe it.
But knowing Haley personally, not because I am gullible because Rick sent me a chat log of my girlfriend sending him messages to go kill himself after the party, I trusted her and she told me that she treated her like a child and was very condescending.
After hearing all of this, and from other people on how much they don't like her, I am now more cemented in the fact that I do not want her back in my life, which feels great because I don't have to deal with that side of her later.
But there is one thing that is bothering me. Why did she hide this side from me for so long? I asked Haley why did she think she did that and she told me she thinks it's because she didn't want me to think poorly of her, which makes sense. But this all doesn't add up to me. I have seen her throw a tantrum before, but that was a really long time ago and I didn't think much of it at the time. Looking back, I haven't really seen this side of her while we were dating, but before we were dating, I can totally remember seeing that side of her.
I know this is more of a rant because I need to get it out of my system, but I would love an outsiders opinion!
What do you think of this situation? How often does situations like this occur? Do you think she broke up with me because she got tired of hiding that side of her? Her and I are on a three-week no contact and I am heavily considering blocking her so I can completely move on, but I have a strong gut feeling (not hope) that she will reach out again asking to get back and I want to tell her no. I won't be harsh about it, I am just going to start with saying that I've analyzed the relationship and I feel that we aren't healthy for each other. Despite us having a totally awesome relationship.
Also, I have been working on myself and moving on just fine without her, so this isn't a desperation to get her back. How do you think I should handle this going forward? Do you think I am being too harsh? Or should I be like "You broke up with me and I've learned from several people about how you can truly be, and I don't want that in my life" and block her from my life.
I will literally take any reasonable advice, so please, fire away!
TL;DR: Girlfriend broke up with me at start of college, would've at least considered getting back with her if she asked in the future because now I want to move on. Found out from friends of mine and hers that she is a selfish brat which contradicts how I saw her from the 8 months that her and I dated and feel deceived and now I do not want her back. However I feel like I am being too harsh on her if I completely block her without getting her response on it if she reaches out and wants to get back (I am not hoping for it, I have pretty much moved on already)
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2020.09.22 10:47 blandman10 A mormon and jw walk into a bar

Being a ex-mormon (exmo for short) I like to wander the exjw redit and see the stories you all share. I have found a new found strength in being exmo and out of cultism in general for 5 years of my 30 year life.
I'd like to share one of my good stories that I had on my 2 year mission that I think we can all learn from that reveals what we do with the people who struggle mentally of witch i am an advocate and mentally weak as I'd like to say of myself struggling with depression, anxiety and sleep apnea.
When I was tracting as we call it knocking on doors.I was knocking on a section of poor housing and we met someone that gladly let us in to talk about Jesus and said that she thought she saw us around. This was a sweet old lady who had a disability and it was obvious that she had talked to a couple of jw's. Us being mormon missionaries didn't like being confused for Jw's decided to teach a lesson then and there maybe because we lacked the numbers which mormon missionaries have to get so they can go up the totem pole to get to missionary heaven. (This was before they advised us not to meet with single women for lessons)
As I came in the appartment it was evident that she had company and it wasn't only then a girl jw lady having a Bible study then and now. Now here's the conundrum what do we do? We could sit in listening to the jw have the Bible study to the poor lady or we just leave. Looking at my companion being a new missionary he seemed to imply we stay.... we listened to the bible study and then the lady didn't stay long and then we proceed to do our own "bible study" (wich waa out of the book of mormon.) And then placed her with the book and then left with a prayer which was our usual routine. We never went back to the house. Never talked to anyone again like they disappeared from the earth. (Just like the book of mormon evidence)
Fast forward 10 years. (Story unrelated) I was on the dating site and I decide to go on a date with a lady whose considerably younger then me like 10 years younger. She opens up about how hard it is getting out of the jw cult. The words she said were "I just want to feel normal" the relationship didn't work out with a lot of other things happening in my life but I can say that these cults just want control. Control of the metally ill and control of the young and vulnerable.
Stay strong. Thank you all for your stories!
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2020.09.22 10:46 blandman10 A mormon and jw walk into a bar

Being a ex-mormon (exmo for short) I like to wander the exjw redit and see the stories you all share. I have found a new found strength in being exmo and out of cultism in general for 5 years of my 30 year life.
I'd like to share one of my good stories that I had on my 2 year mission that I think we can all learn from that reveals what we do with the people who struggle mentally of witch i am an advocate and mentally weak as I'd like to say of myself struggling with depression, anxiety and sleep apnea.
When I was tracting as we call it knocking on doors.I was knocking on a section of poor housing and we met someone that gladly let us in to talk about Jesus and said that she thought she saw us around. This was a sweet old lady who had a disability and it was obvious that she had talked to a couple of jw's. Us being mormon missionaries didn't like being confused for Jw's decided to teach a lesson then and there maybe because we lacked the numbers which mormon missionaries have to get so they can go up the totem pole to get to missionary heaven. (This was before they advised us not to meet with single women for lessons)
As I came in the appartment it was evident that she had company and it wasn't only then a girl jw lady having a Bible study then and now. Now here's the conundrum what do we do? We could sit in listening to the jw have the Bible study to the poor lady or we just leave. Looking at my companion being a new missionary he seemed to imply we stay.... we listened to the bible study and then the lady didn't stay long and then we proceed to do our own "bible study" (wich waa out of the book of mormon.) And then placed her with the book and then left with a prayer which was our usual routine. We never went back to the house. Never talked to anyone again like they disappeared from the earth. (Just like the book of mormon evidence)
Fast forward 10 years. (Story unrelated) I was on the dating site and I decide to go on a date with a lady whose considerably younger then me like 10 years younger. She opens up about how hard it is getting out of the jw cult. The words she said were "I just want to feel normal" the relationship didn't work out with a lot of other things happening in my life but I can say that these cults just want control. Control of the metally ill and control of the young and vulnerable.
Stay strong. Thank you all for your stories!
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2020.09.21 21:39 Jazzlike-Teaching156 [Texas] My son’s ex-girlfriend’s parents are threatening to sue me because my son (apparently) took her virginity in my house

My 16 year old son has an ex-girlfriend (they were 15-16 during their relationship. A lot of this is basically just from what I’ve heard from the parties involved, so I am not sure about if there is to more to it then what I know.
Apparently shortly after the girlfriend turned 16 (January of this year) my son (already 16 at this point) and her, well had sex in my house. Until this week, I had no idea this happened, and certainly did not encourage my son to peruse sexual intercourse with this girl (or anyone), though I have had factual and realistic discussions with him regarding sex, safe sex, and that he would have to decide with his significant other when moving to that stage of the relationship is appropriate and how far they want to take any relationship.
I only know this happened because a few days ago I received a letter from the girlfriend’s father informing me of of a couple specific points (he claims to be a lawyer, I have never met him):
1) That on (date) my son violated his daughter’s (insert name) chastity and raped her.
2) That he and his wife were working with their daughter and a therapist so that his daughter would realize that this action was rape and justified legal/police intervention.
3) That under Texas law, seeing as the location indicated was on my property, I could be sued for damages incurred by my “blatant disregard to her womanhood,” specifically her apparent inability to be wed within the Christian church and emotional trauma related to her lack of understanding that such a sexual action was rape.
Of course, I sat my son down and talked to him about this. He admitted that they had been sexually active during their relationship - twice - with the first time having been in his bedroom at our home. He stated that it was completely consensual, and that he had been in contact with her since they broke up (in March) and was aware that her parents had found out, and were trying to get her to report it as rape, but that she had no intention of doing so because it was not rape and was 100% consensual. He had text messages showing this as well (with her specifically stating that all sexual acts were mutually agreed upon, even one stating that he should keep these text messages safe just in case her parents tried to do something).
I just want to know if I could be held liable for the fact my son took his girlfriend’s virginity on my property in Texas.
By the way, not sure if it is relevant, but her family are strict Mormons and the “therapist” they mentioned in the letter is apparently, according to her, her priest who is apparently treating her horribly.
submitted by Jazzlike-Teaching156 to legaladvice [link] [comments]


2020.09.19 08:21 enter_the_phantom Soft/Casual Triggers

Apologies for a rambling post, it’s late at night and this is my first time posting on this sub.
For some background, I’m not what you’d call a real ExMo as I was never really Mormon to begin with. I had a traumatic experience in middle/high school with the church that went on for several years, and was a victim of a traumatic and highly coordinated missionary dating effort that left me with severe trust issues, a self confidence crisis, and a difficulty maintaining friendships.
Anyway. I was reading a book tonight (“Let’s Call It A Doomsday” by Katie Henry if anyone’s interested) and the main character is Mormon. This made me the slightest bit uncomfortable but wasn’t that big a deal until about a quarter of the way in, where we’re treated to lots of vivid descriptions of her going to church and doing her Mormon thing. I’m really enjoying this book and I’ve wanted to read it for a while but the Mormon thing wasn’t mentioned on any blurbs or plot descriptions that I ever saw as it’s not a huge part of the book’s main conflict. So I had no idea what I was getting into.
I’m having vivid flashbacks. I can hear those damn songs that I never wanted to sing in the first place, I can see the exact layout of the church and count every step to the pews I was so afraid of. I’m feeling every horrible emotion I felt back then, only it’s worse now because I understand those emotions for what they were now. It’s like reliving the whole thing all over again, but worse because back then I didn’t know what was really going on and now I do. I would absolutely count this as a trigger.
So my question is, have any of you experienced things like this? What do you do when your triggers are generalised and not necessarily viewed as something that needs a warning? How do you decide when to push through and when to remove yourself?
Not necessarily looking for advice as I can just skip pages of the book. Just curious for other people’s experiences and ideas about this, as it’s not something I see discussed very often.
submitted by enter_the_phantom to exmormon [link] [comments]


2020.09.18 21:09 jw_mentions /r/exAdventist - "ExJW here, curious about Adventists"

I am a bot! Please send NotListeningItsABook a private message with any comments or feedback on how I work.
EDIT: As of Sat Sep 19 01:59:06 UTC 2020, the post is at [20pts7c]

About Post:

--- --- Notes
Submission ExJW here, curious about Adventists
Comments ExJW here, curious about Adventists
Author --velvetrose
Subreddit /exAdventist
Posted On Thu Sep 17 02:00:25 UTC 2020
Score 20 as of Sat Sep 19 01:59:06 UTC 2020
Total Comments 33

Post Body:

First of all, I am from exjw (Ex-Jehovah’s Witness). I find it awesome that you guys use the term “PIMO” as well! I have a few questions:
1)I work with more than a few Adventist’s and find them all to be the sweetest people. They are very understanding and seriously so sweet. As a Jehovah’s Witness, we have a phrase called “put on the new personality.” Is this something you also practice? Is this also a conversion tactic, Or just how you were raised based off of the examples at church?
2) What made you leave?
For my context, as an ex-Jehovah’s Witness, I can think of at least 10 reasons I left my religion (multiple false “end of the world” prophecies/timeline, disfellowshipping/shunning punishment arrangement, not allowed to research your own religion outside of the religion, pedophile anti-reporting policies, no blood transfusions/risking life because of it, lack of tolerance for lgbt or any outsiders, extreme demand of time, high-control religion (clothing, activities), bible doesn’t make sense, 8 guys control the church ideas and change them whenever they want, the list goes on and on)
3) What do you believe now?
4) Do you miss anything about the religion?
Edit: for those who don’t know, “PIMO” means “Physically in, Mentally out”, those who no longer believe but are too scared to lose their entire network of friends/family, so they fake it. We use it in the exJW community. There’s also “POMO” for those who are openly out of the religion, either by force or by choice, and “PIMI” used to describe those who are still fully in.
Thank you all for your replies!!

Related Comments (7):

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Author orpheus6
Posted On Thu Sep 17 17:05:33 UTC 2020
Score 3 as of Sat Sep 19 01:59:06 UTC 2020
Conversation Size 0
Body link
  1. Friendship evangelism is pushed hard, at least in my experience. Fake niceness towards outsiders is encouraged - it’s amplified if that outsider is an important person. Everyone’s a bit fake-nice at church.
  2. Funnily enough while studying theology my love for exegesis was my undoing (reading whichever bible book in context, trying to understand the author’s intent, relevant historical & social data, linguistic data, etc). Exegesis, specifically with non-SDA scholarly sources, exposed a lot of flaws in my prior SDA fundamentalism and helped me to see that a lot of what was coming from SDA church propaganda, the pulpit, and sugar-sweet devotionals is nonsense if one is to take the bible exegetically. I quickly began to despise devotional readings of the bible and fundamentalist proof-texting.
Basically all the “big SDA proofs” which had been preached at me for decades crumbled upon closer exegetical examination (this set of SDA proofs also included many of the general “Christian/biblical proofs.”
Plus prayer never worked and that always bothered me. It always seemed like god had an easy out whenever you really needed him to actually turn up or affect reality as promised. The “relationship with god” was also completely one-sided, which isn’t really a relationship.
EGW’s influence was also very un-fun and wet-blankety. I’m so glad to be free of her authority.
  1. I’m an amorphous agnostic apostate I guess. I lean atheist - based on the reality I perceive I don’t think there’s a benevolent god behind it - but I leave the option open. Perhaps a trickster god or a demiurge-type god would be more in line with reality.
  2. Maybe the sense of security and the sense of ultimate closure (coupled with death avoidance). These factors don’t make up for the incredible neurotic anxiety, guilt etc.
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Author me_hoyminoy
Posted On Thu Sep 17 05:36:13 UTC 2020
Score 5 as of Sat Sep 19 01:59:06 UTC 2020
Conversation Size 0
Body link
Welcome to the sub!
1) From personal experience, I find a lot of Adventists can be very fake. I did grow up around some genuinely good people in my church, but so many of the big-wigs were completely different underneath the facade, be it from fear or biblical obligation.
2) Like at least one other commenter said, I also had a traumatic experience with my mom that really got the ball rolling on me being PIMO. I’ve told this story on the sub before, but essentially we were being badly abused by my dad. We finally were able to physically separate ourselves from him and move somewhere else safe, and when my mom went to the church elders/pastor for guidance in filing for divorce, they told her she didn’t have grounds for divorce because he hadn’t cheated on my mom with another woman; because that was the only biblical ground for divorce. Essentially condemning my mom to die for the sake of keeping god happy. I never spoke to any of those people again due to the betrayal I felt. I did attend a different church when I moved to another city with an ex, because he was still in. But as soon as we broke up over 5 years ago, I never again attended, even casually. It was the most free I’ve ever felt.
To add on though, aside from the bad experience with leadership, I found the whole church doctrine to be complete bullshit the more I looked at it. So controlling and legalistic, and full of holes that nobody would dare address.
I still can’t believe JW’s are against blood transfusions. I dated a JW guy in high school who was excommunicated during our relationship and it was a huge deal to his family. His mom was inconsolable because her son was going to hell. Just yikes, dude.
3) I honestly haven’t fully labeled my current beliefs, because I don’t really care to. I definitely lean more towards atheism since I find it baffling to think there’s a powerful sky being who has the ability to help, yet actively chooses to not save its creations and let them perish en masse. Even if there does turn out to be a god, gimme eternal damnation, cuz I don’t wanna sing praises to that asshole in perpetuity.
4) Strangely enough, I miss potluck. My family had the young adult sabbath school group over to our house every Saturday and my mom and I would cook and have these amazing vegan meals (actually good ones because my mom is an incredible cook) and just lounge around with people I loved. Then Saturday nights we would get a group and go bowling or do another social activity with everybody. It was great socialization. As an adult now, it’s hard to find a cohesive group in that way since everyone has conflicting schedules and lives.
None of that is worth being in the church for, though.
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Author --velvetrose
Posted On Thu Sep 17 03:35:43 UTC 2020
Score 6 as of Sat Sep 19 01:59:06 UTC 2020
Conversation Size 0
Body link
One of my people! Oh man, my worldwide brotherhood instincts are kicking in, but in an exJW much-more-genuine kind of way. :)
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Author _yellowlights
Posted On Thu Sep 17 12:59:35 UTC 2020
Score 3 as of Sat Sep 19 01:59:06 UTC 2020
Conversation Size 0
Body link
Hi there! I love exSDA - exJW solidarity. From what I read on here, the term PIMO was coined by someone in the exJW community, but I might be wrong. Either way I personally am very grateful for it.
  1. Indeed most Adventists you will meet as a nonSDA will seem very nice people. In my experience, Adventists are eager to maintain this "kind Christian" exterior in order to make a good impression. Reputation and exterior matters more to them than reality. For a lot of them it matters that people outside the church distinguish them from other cults by their niceness and selflessness. Many people in my church bragged about how they brought so many to Adventism just by being nice and helpful, because the people in question thought "wow they are so different". Of course, this isn't to say that most of them aren't actually good, but growing up in this church and seeing how they can really be, has made me wary of those first impressions. However, no, we don't have the new personality rule, the tendency to act nicely is most likely just ingrained in the church mentality.
  2. 90% of your reasons for leaving are mine too. Continuous end-of-the-world fear mongering despite multiple false prophecies has made me stop taking anything about Adventism seriously. The encouragement of blind faith. Bigotry and high control, like clothing, lifestyle, activities, everything in your life has to revolve around church and Adventism. The members' fakeness and passive-aggressiveness, and the mask they put on to seem happy and put together, because everything had to be a competition in the church. And also the obsession with (racist) Ellen White's prophecies and writings, and how she is put above the Bible most of the time. An overall unsettling and uncomfortable experience.
  3. I don't have any religious beliefs now. I'm still trying to unlearn some of the most venomous and traumatizing stuff that was ingrained in me since birth. I don't see myself ever reverting to a state of blind faith for another religion. I don't know if I'm an atheist or anything. I haven't had the energy or desire to look into anything else, I'm still processing my existence outside of SDA. I probably am agnostic, by definition, but I don't really know. When I was in high school I used to call myself an apatheist, it's a term for when you don't care whether God exists or not. Now I don't feel the need to call myself anything, I'm just trying to feel normal.
  4. Nothing at all. I thought I would miss the few friends I had in the church, but I really don't. Most of the things I would think about as positive and worthy of being missed have very little to do with the church/religion and more to do with being an innocent kid. I'm talking like summer camps, games, singing with other kids, learning about nature, etc. Once I hit high school and became more familiar with the doctrine and teachings, I started feeling cold towards the church itself. So now no, can't say I miss anything.
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Author cubej333
Posted On Thu Sep 17 07:25:17 UTC 2020
Score 3 as of Sat Sep 19 01:59:06 UTC 2020
Conversation Size 0
Body link
Good Christians can be sweet, it doesn't have anything to do with how correct their doctrine is. It should be obvious that real Christianity is about a relationship and not about 'right believing' or 'right knowing'. Plenty of wonderful Mormons and non-Christians too.
I wouldn't say I left, I would say that I now identify primarily as Christian and not as Adventist. I am still happy to attend many Adventist churches just as I am happy to attend many Lutheran or Assembly of God or Presbyterian or Methodist churches.
I have met some wonderful Witnesses but have never attended a Jehovah Witness church.
Obviously I am (still) a Christian.
I think Adventists do Sabbath School (for young kids) better than most denominations.
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Author --velvetrose
Posted On Thu Sep 17 03:47:27 UTC 2020
Score 6 as of Sat Sep 19 01:59:06 UTC 2020
Conversation Size 1
Body link
At least when chatting with most of them I see a notable difference. Very easy to talk with. Maybe it’s because we have similar upbringings and similar deep seeded anxiety-ties, or just used to love bombing from church. I can see a few being very grumpy and judge mental, even thinking that I am judging them for something they did wrong (like admitting they secretly drink coffee every day and that’s SO bad! Please don’t tell so-and-so!). I’m glad you chose to leave for your kids. That sabbath thing sounds awful. JWs actually claim to debunk the Sabbath teaching. I guess it’s all on interpretation, which the whole bible is up for interpretation in a million wacky ways, which makes it harder and harder to believe in the first place.
--- --- Notes
Author Tessleonhart
Posted On Thu Sep 17 03:24:14 UTC 2020
Score 3 as of Sat Sep 19 01:59:06 UTC 2020
Conversation Size 1
Body link
I am on this reddit as an ex JW for the same reasons!
submitted by jw_mentions to jw_mentions [link] [comments]


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https://preview.redd.it/46tlqim1xxn51.jpg?width=300&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=38b6374fa0704317d86ab5b23bfcbbfcac409bf7
submitted by IdolA18Sep1l to u/IdolA18Sep1l [link] [comments]


2020.09.18 14:01 softflannel Newly-out lesbian (32) unsure about the future with gf (23)

I've just spent several hours reading through posts to see if I could find something relatable, but nothing felt quite right, so I'm making my own request for insight.
I had reservations from the beginning about dating someone in their early 20s. I know young people can be exceptional, accomplished, and thoughtful. But, I changed so much between ages 20-30, and I think most people experience the greatest transformations in their fundamental selves during this time.
This is a long post, so TL;DR: I love my gf, and many things are great, but I feel like I'm missing something that I need, and I think it's because of our age gap.
My Backstory:
While I was busy doing all of the things I was always doing (working internationally, graduate school, etc), I failed to realize that my disinterest in sex with my husband was because I was actually a lesbian and never going to find men particularly interesting in that way. I ended my loving, if sexually challenged, marriage and moved in with my sister. For a timeline, I came out to my husband in June of this year, moved in with my sister towards the end of that month, and randomly met the girl who became my gf less than a week after moving.
I had a gf for a few months in high school, but we didn't make it past kissing because I was coming off a lot of post-Christianity hangups over physical intimacy. I thought our relationship failed because I wasn't actually gay since I didn't try to have sex with my gf. It didn't help that she told me precisely that and I, without other queer friends or community, decided to believe her. So, my current gf is my first real, genuine, self-actualized relationship with a woman, and it has been the fucking bomb.
Everything feels so easy. I feel emotionally close to her (something I struggled with with my husband despite being best friends). She is smart, smokin' hot, and a good communicator. I always considered myself to have a high libido until I got married and then it tanked. Well, the libido is back, back, back with phenomenal force. Turns out it makes a difference to be with a matched orientation partner. Go figure.
We've been together for a couple months now, and while everything is going well in many regards and feels effortless in areas I'm used to feeling anxious over, I feel like something's missing. The only thing I can think of as an explanation is our age gap. I feel like our stages are fairly miss-matched. She dropped out of college during her second year (no judgement as I also dropped out for a few years), she was raised in the Mormon church while being queer which gave her some nice trauma to work through, and she is figuring out what she wants to do with her future. As for me, I just graduated with an advanced degree in health care, I was living as a repressed lesbian for decades and was married almost 10 years, and I have already done the lion's share of working through my childhood trauma (you're never done).
In case you're unaware, lesbians have a reputation for moving very quickly in their relationships. I thought it was a bogus generalization, but I didn't make the rules, and when we both admitted to loving each other during our first month together it felt fast and terrifying and true.
I'll make some categories and bullet points to explain my dilemma.
Good:
Worries:
I have talked to my gf about my concerns, and she thinks we have something special that's worth fighting for. I'm just not sure. I don't feel like anything is wrong, per se, just that something is missing. I don't feel confident in our relationship. But I don't know if that's because I have unrealistic standards. I don't want to throw away something that is really wonderful in many regards, but I'm uncomfortable that I'm having these concerns after only 2 months together. And, frankly, I didn't end a marriage that was in many ways fulfilling so that I could get into another relationship that was missing something I need.
I feel like it will be hard to meet someone who I would consider "the whole package" because my dating pool is much smaller than for hetero couples, but I also don't want to stop looking. And if I have found that person in my current gf, I don't want to throw her away because I just don't have good perspective. I love her, I miss her when we're apart, but I know that you need more than love. And to be clear, she doesn't think I'm perfect or anything; but she does think we're LTR material.
If we break up, the ideal I would have for my next partner would be someone who is more experienced with life, established in their career and their sense of self, and who challenges me and helps me grow the same as I do for them. And great sex, naturally. I feel like if I met my gf 3-5 years from now, she might be that person. But I don't know what that means for what I should do now. :(
Thanks for reading all of this, and I appreciate any insight and advice.
submitted by softflannel to AgeGap [link] [comments]


2020.09.17 18:29 happy_camp Dating an Ex-Mormon who is about to "come out" to his parents - advice requested!

Hello beautiful people!
Long story short - I moved to SLC last year having spent about 15 years in the Bay Area, and it's been a good journey with a few cultural "gotchas" of the LDS church dominating so much of the predominant culture and tech landscape, which is my industry.
In June of this year, I (35F) matched with someone on Tinder who turned out to be ex-Mormon (36M) (left the church ~5 years ago). I am generally somewhat hesitant to get involved with guys who grew up in an uber conservative faith or culture, as this has burned me before, but there was just something about this guy that was so special to me. Anyways, we started casually hooking up but quickly realized that we were like INTO each other in a huge way. Things since then have moved quickly and we are definitely on the fast track to love-ville. Both of us are just gobsmacked at how compatible we are and how much we enjoy spending time together, and given that we're both in our mid-30s, we're both feeling pretty serious about moving forward in a committed way and excited to be together.
Here's where things are a bit complicated - he's "out" to friends and siblings as having left the church, but his family dynamic is a little bizarre to the point where his parents don't know. He thinks they do on an intuitive level, but it's never been explicitly discussed. Overall, he has a pretty rough relationship with them and it seems quite dysfunctional from an outsider's perspective, but I don't want to judge as I know every family is messed up in some way.
As crazy as I am about this guy, I really don't want to be in a committed relationship at this point in my life where there is a need to conceal the relationship from the person's parents. I'm too old for that! But at the same time I don't want to push someone to do something they don't want to or aren't comfortable doing - also too old for that, haha :)
He recently told me that he is planning to discuss his having left the church with his parents on an upcoming visit in October, as it now feels like the right time given that there's a more concrete catalyst to have this discussion which is well overdue. The catalyst is me, which makes me pretty nervous. For one, I don't want to live with the guilt at having screwed up their relationship even though he swears up and down that this is a conversation he's been needing to happen for a while. For two, I have no idea how this will go and if it turns out to be a huge mess it's a lot for me to take on as a brand new girlfriend even though I'm sure this guy is worth it. Trust me on this one - he's an absolute gem of a person and someone who absolutely brings out the best in me. We're on cloud nine!
Finally, I am worried that this is going to set me up for failure in having a relationship with his family because on some level I might be perceived as some kind of Jezebel seductress that led him away from his faith, which is of course completely untrue.
I guess selfishly I just REALLY wish this conversation had happened before I was in the picture.
So, I guess my questions are these:
1) Most importantly, how can I support him through this process as a romantic interest? Other than living in SLC this year and having read Under the Banner of Heaven, I don't really know much about the dynamics of LDS faith and culture/history, and while I consider myself Methodist, religion isn't a huge part of my life or community so I'm a little clueless on what this all is like.
2) Realistically, what expectations should I have for being accepted into his family if we progress into something more serious, especially if this conversation goes sideways (it probably will).
3) Where are my blind spots here? Deep down maybe on some level I *do* fear that I've unintentionally created a situation that could tear a family apart, and if it weren't for me this relationship could have lived on in awkward perpetuity, and maybe that's actually a better outcome for everyone to avoid the drama? What if he actually would have gone back to the church on his own? Seems unlikely but the grip of Mormonism is powerful it seems.
Any other general advice? Thank you all so much!
submitted by happy_camp to exmormon [link] [comments]


2020.09.13 11:21 dyeknee84 Portland, Oregon, female 35, straight & monogamous seeking something real or friendship only

I like traditional family values modernized clean fun without pretentious fasçades, judgements and nonsensical gender roles. I want to understand someone’s cultural background and actually laugh about inside jokes that only someone raised this way could understand. Feminist matriarch with strong human rights views. I want a life partner and a equal. I have never dated a Mormon nor ex Mormon :/. I am an Ex Molly Mormon, a college convert to agnosticism, life time feminist and who opened up to a lot, :/ fairly liberal (brother says far left, I think moderate for Portland standards). I don’t have time to waste on traditional dating websites aka garbage :), literally 1000s of likes without substance or at very least no time to filter all that :/ exhausting and unfruitful. An ex Mormon man that thinks women are equals would probably understand most of my baggage. I like the clean cut look and with a f Ed up family you survived are a plus in my book lol. Dreamer in that I wish for something better, but really a realist with no time for dishonesty and I am very open about my life and direct. Still not super into drinking and never smoking. Dancing, hiking, camping, and floating are my happy places.
submitted by dyeknee84 to ExMo4ExMo [link] [comments]


2020.09.12 03:43 alienkweenn Jay is 4 Justice Alex Cox Affair Recap - "Maria"

Background About Maria -
Background About the Event -
Day 1
Day 2
Day 3
Day 4
Day 5
Day 6 (?)
Last days
Last Day
Random Conversation
submitted by alienkweenn to LoriVallow [link] [comments]


2020.09.07 17:10 110-115-120 Dated a Mormon and need some support

So I (a gay non-Mormon) dated a gay (inactive at the time) Mormon for a couple of years, and it was going well until the pandemic. We didn't move in with each other, but we spent a lot of time together. I knew we were not politically aligned, but I didn't expect it to be a major issue, and it wasn't until the pandemic occurred. Once the stay-at-home orders were issued, I took them seriously as I believe in science and medical experts, plus I wanted to help flatten the curve and avoid overwhelming the health care system. My ex is a Trumper (not exactly sure why, but I believe it may be related to his affiliation to the Republican party because of his indoctrinated beliefs against abortion), and did not take the virus seriously. We couldn't agree on how to handle things (as far as following safety protocols & public health recommendations were concerned), and ultimately broke up because of that. I keep wracking my brain and wondering if I could have done anything differently to make things work out without compromising my ethics, or if this is something that most Mormons are conditioned into and I should avoid dating any more of them because of that.
submitted by 110-115-120 to exmormon [link] [comments]


2020.09.06 01:24 honesthibiscus Influencers, Hawaii mormons, no rules?

Hi ex mormons! I'm nevermo and I also usually only comment on reddit, but I live in Hawaii and have been on a health kick so recently followed a popular healthy living instagram blogger who lives here.
This influencer has 1 mil followers doesn't mention religion much so I figured they were just typical hippie surfer christian until I saw a reference to family on "2 year service trips" and dodging a question about posting wedding pictures. I connected the dots when I realized this blogger is married into a large mormon family here that owns a restaurant in Laie that I went to once and was staffed entirely with BYUH students lol.
My question here is about garments and other rules. This family is huge and well-known. Kids have pro surf sponsorships, parents are influencers and restaurant owners. None of them wear garments or avoid caffeine it seems.
I assumed the garments weren't common because none of the mormons here in Hawaii, even non-influencers, seem to wear them or even dress modestly? But reading this sub it seems otherwise. Is it the weather? One of my college friends (not BYUH) was aggressively devout and is dating a returned missionary but she swears and wears crop tops everywhere except when she goes to take pics in front of the Laie temple (she also wouldn't talk to me about her religion at all when I asked during a time when I was having trouble and looking for faith because she looked down on me for drinking and not being chaste...like come on I was 18 and vulnerable, leading me to the church would have been taking candy from a baby! but I guess I wasn't worthy haha) Another coworker chose to go on her mission but then still dresses in short shorts and tank tops now that she's back. 99% of the ethnically polynesian mormons I know have tattoos.
So basically, why is Hawaii apparently so lax? There are more mormons here than anywhere else I lived on the mainland and they're just as closed-off with info but a lot less visibly "culty." Why do influencers not seem to care about garments but all the "normal" people in this sub have such a hard time breaking with it?
Just wanted to hear thoughts from you guys!
submitted by honesthibiscus to exmormon [link] [comments]


2020.09.04 09:17 jasminooow An Ally.

Hey guys,
So I'm not a JW and had no idea about it until I dated one for the past 9 months. (he was living a double life). Anyway, I'm also a psych student. And will be a psychologist in the coming years. And I see a huge GAP in what psychologists offer to... people like you guys. Ex JW, Ex Mormons etc. I see a huge GAP in the research and implications these high control religions and exiting them has.
SO I just want to say I see you. And I'm trying to figure out where and how I could get started on training to help the population of ex-high control religion members.
I DISCLAIM: I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT ITS LIKE, but I've had a small peep through the window (of my ex-boyfriends struggles + life). And there needs to be more awareness of whats going on and MORE done to help recovery...
What have your experiences been in therapy?
submitted by jasminooow to exjw [link] [comments]


2020.09.03 08:01 SecureDropTheWhistle Dating for Jack / Ex Mormons

Basically I would love to be able to find people to date who aren't active practicing Mormons (or active practicing another religion for that matter).
Personally I still consider myself to be a moral person who simply fails to see the absolutism in many religions and I'd love to find people with similar viewpoints. The hard thing for me is that I grew up in a Mormon household and I am an RM so the partying scene never was for me and most people who lean towards the non-denominational / agnostic side of things tend to be party people.
I know that some people who grow up in Nevada often grow up with Mormons friends but don't convert because they don't believe in it. People like this tend to be great because they will understand what my family is like and why I don't share their faith. IDK though, checking out the young peoples dating scene in Nevada is an idea however I'm looking for a more general approach to finding good people to date without spending my weekends in bars.
submitted by SecureDropTheWhistle to exmormon [link] [comments]


2020.09.02 12:53 jw_mentions /r/AmItheButtface - "AITB for telling people I married my husband for a green card?"

I am a bot! Please send NotListeningItsABook a private message with any comments or feedback on how I work.
EDIT: As of Wed Sep 02 12:48:24 UTC 2020, the post is at [335pts3c]

About Post:

--- --- Notes
Submission AITB for telling people I married my husband for a green card?
Comments AITB for telling people I married my husband for a green card?
Author heathenborne
Subreddit /AmItheButtface
Posted On Tue Sep 01 18:58:14 UTC 2020
Score 335 as of Wed Sep 02 12:48:24 UTC 2020
Total Comments 49

Post Body:

I want to start this off by saying my husband thinks this is hilarious. He’s neither offended nor hurt.
I married my husband for a green card, that’s not the end of the story but it is an objectively true statement.
We met when I was 19 on vacation in the US and he was 20, I’m Scandinavian and he’s American. He was in the military at the time so moving to my country was out of the question so we did long distance going back and forth for a year. At that point we knew we had to make a decision to be either in or out, and since the US doesn’t issue “dating visas” we applied for a fiancé visa.
Our relationship has always been real, we’ve been married for 7 years but if things had been different I would never have married a guy that young after a year of almost exclusively Skyping. We got married so I could get a green card so we could be together.
When people ask me why I got married so young I typically just say “for a green card” then explain and it usually gets a laugh.
The problem is my husbands family, who do NOT think this is funny. They think it’s humiliating for my husband, degrading for me and disrespectful of our marriage and marriages in general.
I know this is definitely not asshole territory but since Americans are a lot more intense about marriage culture than we are at home I think I may be ruffling some feathers in a hurtful way. Am I the buttface here?

Related Comments (3):

--- --- Notes
Author Ncfetcho
Posted On Wed Sep 02 02:03:07 UTC 2020
Score 58 as of Wed Sep 02 12:48:24 UTC 2020
Conversation Size 8
Body link
Sounds like the cult i was in. Got married twice just to be a JW.
--- --- Notes
Author Ncfetcho
Posted On Wed Sep 02 06:08:55 UTC 2020
Score 2 as of Wed Sep 02 12:48:24 UTC 2020
Conversation Size 1
Body link
Ahh we are cousins! Fun fact... Jw and Mormons followed the same people for quite sometime. Then Smith and Russel had a falling out over Doctrine and Smith broke off and formed the LDS and after Russell died, the Jehovah's witnesses broke off. They were originally both Bible Students.
--- --- Notes
Author Galaxy_Convoy
Posted On Wed Sep 02 02:24:25 UTC 2020
Score 36 as of Wed Sep 02 12:48:24 UTC 2020
Conversation Size 6
Body link
Oof. I have heard horror stories from ex-JW Redditors.
submitted by jw_mentions to jw_mentions [link] [comments]


Ex-mormon Q&A - YouTube Jehovah's Witnesses Sexuality And Dating - EX JW - YouTube I'm Mitz Nelson, and I'm an Ex-Mormon - YouTube Why I Left Mormonism - YouTube What Mormons think about dating in high school... Why Can't Mormons Date Before Age 16? Dating non-Mormons Dating Tips from Kwaku  3 Mormons

Ex-Mormon groups Meetup

  1. Ex-mormon Q&A - YouTube
  2. Jehovah's Witnesses Sexuality And Dating - EX JW - YouTube
  3. I'm Mitz Nelson, and I'm an Ex-Mormon - YouTube
  4. Why I Left Mormonism - YouTube
  5. What Mormons think about dating in high school...
  6. Why Can't Mormons Date Before Age 16?
  7. Dating non-Mormons
  8. Dating Tips from Kwaku 3 Mormons

An Ex Ex-Mormon's Story 3 Mormons - Duration: 30:00. Saints Unscripted 42,625 views. ... Mormon Dating Culture (Female Perspective) - Duration: 22:43. Saints Unscripted 23,986 views. Ex Mormon Gives Most Incredible Testimony EVER! Will Give You Chills! ... 17:07. Mormon Girl College Dating Tips - Duration: 12:14. Sunday Jess 3,318 views. 12:14. Mormonism Crash Course: Secrets ... #EXJW In this video, I go slightly off-topic to address an issue that affects a lot of current and former JWs. It's time that I answer your most asked questions! SUBSCRIBE, LIKE, COMMENT, DONATE. FOLLOW ME / CONTACT ME: EMAIL: [email protected] INSTAGRAM: @c... Many people date in high school. But timeless counsel from leaders in the Church of Jesus Christ advises people under 16 to refrain from dating and even at age 16, to not date one person ... Ex-Mormon Christian Mitz Nelson shares her story in Manti, UT. Transcript available here: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1lz-itps4IHhN_BkGmskF8NtimZd6cCc... My Blog http://www.lahwf.me My Watch Company http://www.durden.life Use code 'lahwf' for 25% off! My Main Channel http://www.youtube.com/lahwf My insta... He would explain that the prophets in the Mormon Church had counseled against dating before mature feelings have developed. This counsel is found in the Strength of Youth Pamphlet from the LDS Church.